Endri Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 "Sonic Attitude is NOT dead" Update Thread!!! Warning! Not 56k friendly!! Greetings, everyone It's been a while since I last posted progress over this project. I would like to announce that the project is NOT dead, and progress has been made. One thing that I would like to note is that I redefined the engine for the PC version. The PC version will now feature a brand new engine entirely customized by me myself. I like to call it, "Attitude Engine". It's an entire SDK for developing Sonic games for PC. In fact, you can you it to develop other types games but Sonic games, but the main sources included are for Sonic in general. The main features in the engine I belive is SSAO and almost-with-no-pre-calculations-at-all Global Illumination <3 Demo will be playable at SAGE2k9. So... Let's wait until then! P.S.: Now with 100% more parallax mapping! Yay! ***************************************************** 08/10/2008: ***************************************************** I would like to announce my project It's Sonic Attitude I've been gathering ideas for this game since the end of 2007. I wanted to make a diferent Sonic Fan Game, so I decided to start developing this game for Nintendo DS (this is the first Sonic Fan Game for DS, I belive ) ). I also making others two versions. One for Windows and other for Mobiles (currently I-Phone and I-Pod Touch ). The game is basicly 2.5D (the stages are completly 3D, but the gameplay will be 2D). I'm using an new engine that is been completly developed by me. The engine will play like the Sonic Rush one... Here are some screenshots: And here is a Tech Demo (adapted for Windows): Old Tech Demo (August, 2008) (Note that the engine was not emplemented at all, this is a demo just to show a little of the work, and to show that I'm not lying!=P There will be lots of bugs, glitches, bloopers and the likes! ) Soon I'll upload the ROM of the DS version, so people with flashcards will be able to test in their DS' (or using NO$GBA ) I'm also working in the .jar version for the mobiles, but this one will take a while... Also, here is my homepage, so people can track down my work (portuguese): http://www.endri.webs.com/ And an english translated version (using Google Translate): http://www.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.freewebs.com%2Fendri%2F&hl=pt-BR&ie=UTF8&sl=pt&tl=en On a side note, I would like to clarify the Sonic Attitude rumor. On March, 2008, I put in my homepage the link for the first demo version. Them a friend of mine, since the page was in portuguese, confused everything and started spreading rumors that SEGA would be developing Sonic Attitude for DS. I don't know with SEGA is really developing a Sonic Attitude too, but if they are, I'm pretty much sure that this isn't for DS. And if they are, this is just a coincidence. Well, enjoy! EDIT: Oh sorry! I forgot! To move, use the "arrow keys". "X" is the jump button. Also, there's the DEBUG MODE button. Press "Left Shift" to enter the debug mode. There you will be able to move around freely. In the debug mode, use the arrow keys to move and "A" and "Z" keys to move forward and towards the screen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slingerland Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 Very rad, but could you tell me how to control this game? Like, what's jump? Also, submit this to SAGE right now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endri Posted August 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 Oh sorry! I forgot! To move, use the "arrow keys". "X" is the jump button. Also, there's the DEBUG MODE button. Press "Left Shift" to enter the debug mode. There you will be able to move around freely. In the debug mode, use the arrow keys to move and "A" and "Z" keys to move forward and towards the screen. This debug mode is useful to see the rest of the stage without fails... Also, as you said, this is really "rad." Should I really send this to SAGE? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slingerland Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 Also, as you said, this is really "rad." Should I really send this to SAGE? YEEEEEESSS. Also, thanks. EDIT: OK, that's pretty awesome. The alternate angle on the bottom screen is ridiculously cool, but if I speed through a loop or a corkscrew, I fly off into the oblivion. I have to "pace" myself to get through these obstacles in order to stay on course. You might want to look into that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endri Posted August 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 OK, that's pretty awesome. The alternate angle on the bottom screen is ridiculously cool, but if I speed through a loop or a corkscrew, I fly off into the oblivion. I have to "pace" myself to get through these obstacles in order to stay on course. You might want to look into that. Well, about the bottom screen, it's something I put in order to hold place until I implement the complete engine. The bottom screen will be used to play the tridimensional parts of the game, using the stylus. The camera will change to the backs of Sonic, and as soon as the 3D part ends, it will go back to that panoramic view! I'm glad you liked it! Also, as you said, this is really "rad." Should I really send this to SAGE? YEEEEEESSS. Also, thanks. Since we are into it... could you tell me how do I submit the game to SAGE? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OverbounD Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 That's pretty cool though I didn't get far. I would definatly submit this to Sage just go to sagexpo.org and you can figure out how to submit (register) it. Also, what exactly are you making this with? So There will be both a windows and DS version of this game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endri Posted August 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 That's pretty cool though I didn't get far. I would definatly submit this to Sage just go to sagexpo.org and you can figure out how to submit (register) it. Thanks for the hint! I'll give it a try! Also, what exactly are you making this with? So There will be both a windows and DS version of this game? Exactly! There will be three versions actually. The main version is for DS, but I'm adapting it for both Windows and celphones. I'm using C++ and the homebrew kit for developing the DS version. Them, in adapting the source-code for LUA to develop the PC version, since I want it to run not only in the Windows, but in the Linux and Mac as well. But for now I'll be using Blitz3D for the Windows version. And for the Mobile version I'm adapting the code for use withing Java3D, but currently the only mobiles platforms that run it is the I-Phone and I-Pod Touch... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slingerland Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 Since we are into it... could you tell me how do I submit the game to SAGE? Head to this site, read the instructions, and fill out the form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RGX Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 Very cool project, I wish I could play it on my DS. Unfortunately I don't have the equipment for it. I remember a while back a few websites mentioned something about a sonic game by the name of Sonic Attitude for the DS and it was to appear at e3 08. Strange...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damizean Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 Very surprising work, Endri I'm quite interested on know about it's mechanics and innerworking, maybe we could chat a little about it. Anyway, I noticed the upper path on the background, are you going to use On-Rails mechanics at some point or keep it only in that linear plane? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The ParadoxX Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 Error: Memory Access Violation =( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbfalcon Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 This looks interesting... I'll try running it once I get home... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark the Echidna Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 Hey, that's pretty cool! And welcome to SFGHQ. Bom ter mais gente brasileira por aqui. XD Thought I haven't tested it yet (will reboot on Windows later), it looks impressive by the screenshots. I see you registered for SAGE. Do you think you can provide some updated information/demo for it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khorney Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 how is the dual screen function supposed to work for ipod touch? is the main game just going to have a longer display, or will it be held upright? anyway, this should make a decent app for my ipod, keep it up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endri Posted August 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 Thanks everyone! I've submitted the project to SAGE already! Just waiting for approval now... Oh look! Lots of questions! I remember a while back a few websites mentioned something about a sonic game by the name of Sonic Attitude for the DS and it was to appear at e3 08. Strange...... Actually, it was a mistake commited by a friend of mine: On a side note, I would like to clarify the Sonic Attitude rumor. On March, 2008, I put in my homepage the link for the first demo version. Them a friend of mine, since the page was in portuguese, confused everything and started spreading rumors that SEGA would be developing Sonic Attitude for DS. I don't know with SEGA is really developing a Sonic Attitude too, but if they are, I'm pretty much sure that this isn't for DS. And if they are, this is just a coincidence. So, basicly, he confused everything and started spreading humors... and it spread quite quickly throughout the internet... Very surprising work, Endri I'm quite interested on know about it's mechanics and innerworking, maybe we could chat a little about it.Anyway, I noticed the upper path on the background, are you going to use On-Rails mechanics at some point or keep it only in that linear plane? Damizean, actually I'm using pathfinding. I just forgot to set the waypoints in this Tech Demo... The game will play like the Advance/Rush series. Since the gameplay gonna be like the 2D Sonic games, there will be layer transitions (from the back layer to the front layer, also, as you can see, the upper path you noticed is in the back layer... if the player misses that path the player will end up in the next front layer and so on). The transitions from layer to layer will be so seamless that it will look like the game is completly 2D Bom ter mais gente brasileira por aqui. XD Que bom! Um brasileiro! Nossa! Mark the Echidna, eu não sabia que você é brasileiro! Assim podemos conversar melhor! I see you registered for SAGE. Do you think you can provide some updated information/demo for it? I'm working on it right now. I'm setting up the textures and animations for Sonic's 3D model. Also, I'm updating the engine a little and trying to adapt it to fit the Windows environment... Error: Memory Access Violation=( Hey, The ParadoxX, could you give me more details so I can help you, like, wich OS you're currently using, or, the machine specs, or any other useful information? how is the dual screen function supposed to work for ipod touch? is the main game just going to have a longer display, or will it be held upright? anyway, this should make a decent app for my ipod, keep it up! Both I-Phone and I-Pod Touch will be held horizontaly. The game will play like the DS/PC version, the main diference is that the interactive parts will be played in the same screen (in other words, the game will change from 2D to 3D and you will be able to "touch" the screen to move from left to right, and quickly touch the screen to jump)! Pretty cool! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbfalcon Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 Oooh... iTouch... I'll be sure to yoink my brother's and try it on it... (and I still need to get a cycloDS card...) SAGE gets more awesome every day... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OverbounD Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 Error: Memory Access Violation=( Unzip it I had the same problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damizean Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 I didn't notice you said you were using Blitz3D for the Windows version. Are you using the raycasting methods for checking the collision with terrain and calculating the terrain up vector, or the bouding sphere methods? Mark and I were toying around making a Blitz3D engine. We used the bounding sphere collision, and everything seemingly worked fine... but then we noticed there were some collision problems on certain triangle normals (specifically, on cases of upside-down geometry that isn't "flat" (ie, has little slope on one of the x or z axes), making the character bounding sphere slide over the wrong collision plane and rendering it unable to pass through some geometry properly :/ I know the problem isn't ours... to a degree. I made a separate test with most of the code cut down, and leaving only the up vector detection with basic controls, and it still behaved the same. Maybe you can share some thoughts about it or suggest something In exchange, I could lend a hand if you need help in anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endri Posted August 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 Since the engine is mainly programmed for DS using C++, I'm adapting the source-code for use with other languages, as basic for Blitz3D. I'm using the sphere-to-polygons collision method. I'm trying to picture off your problem, but I quite didn't get it at all. But, most the time, all collisions issues is due to UpdateWorld. So, in my engine, I generally put the moviment section before UpdateWorld, them I put some checks after UpdateWorld but before RenderWorld, so, if it behave correctly, I've just to render everything, else, the routine corrects the collision before rendering. So basicly, avoid using UpdateWorld just before calling RenderWorld, or using more than one UpdateWorld. Also, I have a question. In most of your 2D engines you use trigonometry. Them, uppon collison, it checks the angle and move the characters along the adjacent and opposite of the triangle in accord to the hypotenuse. But, how do you make the character walk in the wall if he is too fast? As you can see in this example, the character (blue ball) is in an 45 degree slope (an smooth slope). The slope is really curvy. The character is going in a constant speed of 5 units. But, as seem in the image, he is too fast, and his last position after the moviment is going to be out of the collision range. In other words, he will be in the "air". But in your engines I see the characters running in a pretty high speed, but yet they keep running from the floor to a downward wall smoothly and without setting off the ground. How do you accomplish that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damizean Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 I added you to my MSN Messenger account, hope you don't mind. There are two approaches for preventing that. One is adjusting the slopes "snapping" routines using character's speed as reference. Since the slopes down routine is basically a "push until collide" routine, adjusting the amount of pixels to push the character will ensure the collision sphere to keep in range with the terrain, even at high speeds or large angle differences. However this approach has a side effect, as it may detect a small level changes as a slope, making the character instantly "snap" the ground (wich looks terrible). Another approach is using movement tweening to control the collisions in various steps. That way you can check and adjust correctly to the different terrain angles on each step and prevent terrain piercing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Frenzy Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 For DS? count with me for level design >_< i want this project to be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endri Posted August 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 There are two approaches for preventing that. One is adjusting the slopes "snapping" routines using character's speed as reference. Since the slopes down routine is basically a "push until collide" routine, adjusting the amount of pixels to push the character will ensure the collision sphere to keep in range with the terrain, even at high speeds or large angle differences. However this approach has a side effect, as it may detect a small level changes as a slope, making the character instantly "snap" the ground (wich looks terrible). That's what I've been using in my engine. Move the character downwards in the direction of it's vectors normals, using the character's speed as reference. If his speed = 5 then move downward in his normal vector 5 units. But it sometimes gave that instantly "snap" effect, so I changed it for something like this: move downward (speed*0.5) units. So it happenned to be: If his speed = 5 then move downward in his normal vector 2.5 units, to reduce the "instant snap". But it also reduces the speed threshold... But I found the tweening control a really good idea! Is this the method you use in your engines? Also, do you know the method used in Sonic's original engine? And, Damizean, tell me more about your collisions problems. I know that UpdateWorld don't get along very well with RenderWorld. Also, I have reports of FastImage lib and decls changing the behavior of some collisions elements... I don't know what FastImage have to do with collisions, and I don't know why it has issues with UpdateWorld either... so, most the time, avoiding using it solved most of my collision problems. If you use it I'd recommend you to make tests without it. For DS? count with me for level design >_< i want this project to be done. Thanks, Blue Frenzy! I love your level design skills! It would be a great help! EDIT: Also, how many people noticed the twisted platform from Sonic 2 ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbfalcon Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 Didn't the original games use preset movement settings for each tile (not sure if it was on all tile sizes or only some)? Like certain tiles would make Sonic move in a specified direction based on his current speed... I do recall someone making a replica of that before... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endri Posted August 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 Perhaps saxman with his ProSonic project would know something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbfalcon Posted August 11, 2008 Report Share Posted August 11, 2008 Perhaps saxman with his ProSonic project would know something? Most likely. Maybe even Taxman of RetroSonic (I bloody love that game...)... I think it used similar concepts to the originals... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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