Sonic and the Secret Rings - Official Discussion

[Serephim]

So, everyone complains about the difficuly on this game..

So... How hard exactly does this game get?

Hard as playing through Very Hard mode of Super Smash Brothers?

Or Hard as Fuck, like playing through Dante Must Die in DMC 3?

[Pheonix Gamma]

Hard as in Trial and Error hard. As in, you're GOING to die after a certain point in the game.

So I just beat the final boss at about 7 and a half hours. It was pretty cool, but shaking the remote was tiring. I didn't really like how they let you fight the "final" boss, but unless you decided to do all of the "optional" missions in that world, you couldn't reach the true final battle, and since I didn't keep track of the rings, I had to sit through a total of 3 unskipable staff credits.

So yea, I still have a lot of missions to do, and I hardly have any medals, so I'll probably go back and get some, since I production stuff.

[DimensionWarped]

All? You only need to do about 4 missions to get the World Ring there.

[Pheonix Gamma]

yea, but you only got them one at a time, so I had to race Uhu and not get any rings (I HATE THOSE MISSIONS) and kill 20 dudes and crap. I just wish they made me do that BEFORE I fought the boss and sat through the credits. Like, you beat the first mission, "ALRIGHT LETZ FIGHT!", "aw we got all of the rings, but we really have less, oh well."

Just make me do all of the missions I need to do to get the rings, then take me to the boss or new world or whatever.

[DimensionWarped]

Honestly, I found the out-of-orderness of the missions to be what made the missions worth playing for the most part.

[Pheonix Gamma]

Oh, I did too. Except they weren't really out of order at the end.

You need X missions cleared to get the rings, right? Offer me more than 2 missions at a time, then, because I don't want to collect 0 rings OR beat Uhu.

Also, the missions just make the story wierd. Hey we have to save the world! But first, let's try not to break any jars! I think the missions should have been more...I dunno..tied to the plot? Like in sky Ruins, you find Sinbad, then the next mission you have to free Sinbad. It made sense.

But

Finding Erazor, then him being all "LET'S FIGHT", you want to go fight him. But if you want to see the final fight, you need the last ring. So when he says "LET'S FIGHT". you say "Hold on, I need to race this blue ball, not get any rings or die, and kill 20 dudes first." It kills the flow.

So what I would propse is missions that make more sense, organize them a little better, and when I learn Speed Break and Time Break, actually tell me how to use it, because I had no clue until I randomly pressed the D-pad.

[DimensionWarped]

The Uhu missions are extremely easy to get golds on.

NOTE: 3 gold medals worth of spoilers

I think its safe to say based on these early concepts of Erazor, Shara, and Solomon that they initially wanted to take a more cartoon-styled approach to the character designs. I wish they had included some early concept artwork of Sonic... he would probably have looked much different if they had gone along with that style.

On the other hand, it could always just be something they included to make us think the development process was deeper than it actually was... like several of the napkin scrawls that they called memos.

EDIT:

Oh wait, they did. His spines are much... straighter, but that might just be due to the expression on his face.

[Pheonix Gamma]

actually, all of the 2D cutscenes have pretty straight quills.

Also, sun-nipples are the devil's work.

[MidimanNull]

Also, sun-nipples are the devil's work.

insert bible here

[Pheonix Gamma]

http://www.sonicstadium.org/articles/117/

Seems a sequel is indeed coming. Maybe by then they'll iron out some stuff too. Also, judging by the ending, I wouldn't be surprized if they went all Sonic 3 & Knuckles and had you control the classic trio. It'd definately add some depth to the barebones gameplay that Secret Rings has already layed out.

[ila]

Take anything from Sonic Stadium with a grain of salt these days.

EDIT: 777 posts

[DimensionWarped]

I'm surprised Yojiro doesn't bitchsmack people every time someone says "The on rails thing brings it closer to 2D Sonic."

I swear, I know I would. None of the 2D games were ever on rails...

[Pheonix Gamma]

I'm surprised Yojiro doesn't bitchsmack people every time someone says "The on rails thing brings it closer to 2D Sonic."

I swear, I know I would. None of the 2D games were ever on rails...

Uh, obviously people are referring to the fantastic Sonic 2 special stages, duh!

::hated those stages::

But you know, I do see what people mean by saying it's kinda old school. You're Sonic, and ou run foward, just like you ran to the right on the Genisis. I sorta see it as Super Paper Mario, where you have the classic view from the side, then you flip it 90 degrees. It's still the same stage, just from a different view. I'm not saying they're the exact same thing, I'm just saying that those statements are somewhat justified.

[Serephim]

3D games will never be old school, because im sure to recreate one of the Old School levels, the entire stage would end up looking like Green Hill Zone on SA2. Narrow, but pretty huge with the height scale and everything. you would have to have invisible edge guards on most of the walls, too.

They COULD pull it off, but they would have to simply put emphisis on the fact that each stage is a ZONE, and not an AREA or something.

It would take a VERY skilled level artist to create a level like that. 3D sonic games obviously go in a different direction (except for Sonic Adventure), and i doubt their going to go back to the Sonic Adventure format, so i really dont see what all the fuss is about. As long as they do what they do well, theres no reason to bitch about it "not being a real sonic game" because that is what the new "sonic games" are going to be.

Secret Rings had the ABILITY to recreate any old sonic level they wanted to, but they diddnt take that direction at all it seems. Secret Rings is on a kind of restricted path that would be required to recreate a 2D level.

[DimensionWarped]

Its not so much that it takes a ton of skill to translate a 2D level into a 3D level... its that it takes a certain mindset that is difficult to fathom.

@PG: You don't really even spend most of your time running to the right in the genesis games. Thats one of the things that distinguishes it from the Advance titles.

In chemical plant act 2 for instance, you'd run to the right for the first half of the stage, run all the way back to the left side of the stage, get carried to the right by a tube to the center point (one route), and then do another forward then left segment before getting to the final boss stretch.

On the other hand, you also have casino night zone... which more or less has nothing but a straight right path.

[Slingerland]

On the other hand, you also have casino night zone... which more or less has nothing but a straight right path.

Ah...but there are so much crap to distract you. I play around in the pinball tables for a good 2-3 minutes.

Regarding Secret Rings, I have 18 gold medals and the rest are silver. The silvers netted me the... (spoiler if you don't want to know what gets unlocked):

...the production team introduction? Which, honestly, was pretty lame.

DW, when do get the "Ring Exchange" skill and assorted other awesome skills?

[Pheonix Gamma]

Its not so much that it takes a ton of skill to translate a 2D level into a 3D level... its that it takes a certain mindset that is difficult to fathom.

@PG: You don't really even spend most of your time running to the right in the genesis games. Thats one of the things that distinguishes it from the Advance titles.

In chemical plant act 2 for instance, you'd run to the right for the first half of the stage, run all the way back to the left side of the stage, get carried to the right by a tube to the center point (one route), and then do another forward then left segment before getting to the final boss stretch.

On the other hand, you also have casino night zone... which more or less has nothing but a straight right path.

And in Rings, you're not just running foward either. Sonic makes turns, goes up or along walls, etc. He'll ride on little doodads (bricks in Marble Zone, the giant top in Marble Garden, those lifts in...uh..Hilltop Zone? I forget...)

For the record, I'm not saying Secret Ring=Genisis Sonics. I'm just saying that they have similarities.

3D games will never be old school

They COULD pull it off

Contradict much?

[DimensionWarped]

@Slingerland:

I'm pretty sure you get the rings above 100 -> experience skill either at a certain level (somewhere between sixty and seventy), or a sub-version of it (drains your soul gauge a little and costs almost a third as much to equip) by getting a gold medal on a particular mission in Night Palace.

Other awesome skills:

Highest level maneuverability skills - between 60 and 80

Sub highest maneuverability skills - Golds on missions between Levitated ruin and the skeleton place.

Sub Experience Gaining skills - golds on Night Palace levels

Sub Attack skills - golds on Sand Oasis and Dino Jungle

I'm not sure about any of these, but this seems to be when I got these skills... I'm not sure though.

Also, Aegis Slider you get just by leveling along with volcano slider.

@PG: Yes, but the difference is really in the control. You do all of those things in 3D Sonic too, but the problem is that its to a limited degree.

Also, on any given stage, you have no control over which path it is you take in SSR. You always had the choice in the 2D Sonic games.

Really though, I just don't see too many ways that SSR is similar to an old Sonic game aside from some refreshing stage variety and uh... spikes!

[Pheonix Gamma]

Some levels have branching paths, or at least, the earlier stages do. Later missions have a few here and there as well.

Also, I think it's more oldschool because Sonic isn't some tremendous pussy. He's not saying "We won because...WE'RE SONIC HEROOOOES!" or some lame crap. He's even got his old one liners, so it reminds me of the 90's Archie Sonic (not the current one, who's all ugly and serious)

Add the fact that you're ONLY Sonic, and you're ONLY running, with breaks of cool little scenes where you're surfing or whatever (I loved how Adventure 1 took the time to add cool little things here and there.)

Also, H-Super Extend is fricken' awesome. I was replaying the Scorpion boss, used homing, and Sonic and the boss were almost going the same speed, so he kept flying foward XD

I'm missing one mission in Lost Proluge, and don't know what move it is :E Anyone know what the last mission you unlock is? Cause I did all of the ones that were just "get to the finish"

[Slingerland]

Nah nah, DW. "Ring Exchange" takes any rings you collect and turns them into 2 pearls, thus making the "Hands Off" missions INCREDIBLY EASY. That skill I want bad. Do you have it?

[DimensionWarped]

No. Never heard of it.

@PG: None of those things make me think of it as much of an oldschool Sonic game in the way they were executed.

On the rare branch off, you rejoin the main route within 10 seconds.

[Pheonix Gamma]

Well does it really matter? If someone says "this reminds me of the old games. I like it" would it really mean squat at all?

BTW, I rememer hearing that supposedly there were remixes of some old songs in the secret book. Yay or Nay?

[SonicProject]

I personally think it reminds me more of the classic games because it's actually what Sonic's gameplay was supposed to be. Speed and action. The previous 3D entries were bogged down with exploration and silly features such as weapons and "team play". I still enjoyed Sonic Adventure, though. Even if it wasn't the speedy, action-packed hedgehog I knew and loved.

[ila]

I still can't be Erazor. I suck.

[DimensionWarped]

I could go on and on about how little actual focus there was on speed in the Genesis titles... and on and on some more.

Anyway, its always fun to see that analysis continues to be as skin deep as ever for most.