Sonic the Hedgehog 4! FINAL DEMO OUT!

[The ParadoxX]

Wow... I deal with fruty loops for months and could not make good stuff like yours.

Well, I think it's not just a matter of knowing the tool, but I'm a terrible melody inventor...

[TRD]

As I said in the chat, awesome work Spike.

[Spike]

Due to problems (And my bodily requirement of sleep) the demo will not be ready until very late tonight (Technically Thursday morning). Please bear with me and take into consideration that staying up for days at a time is not good for me and I am trying to cut back on it. Right now I'm feeling dizzy and light-headed, so I'm going to take a nap. See you at release.

[Black]

This Game Is must See!!!!!

[Spike]

This Game Is must See!!!!!

Thanks.

On another note, the new demo is pushed back another day. It seems like every time I manage to fix all of the problems, a new one arises. The last one will not take long to fix, but I'm going to bed. I'm not at all to motivated to work another late night on this due to an overall shitty day today.

[Spike]

FINAL DEMO RELEASED! Some changes are:

-New, charging spindash

-New Act segments added

-Sonic can now Wall Jump

-Spiffed up level design

-Two new gimmicks

-New minigame in Sonic's story

-All mentioned glitches fixed

[OverbounD]

There are still way to many badniks. There were so many cheap kills. I got launched off a ramp in act 3 only to be taken out by 3 badniks. There are a bunch of spots where you get launched up a half pipe only to be hit by a badnik. I'd say at least cut the badniks in half.

The new part of act 1 "I think" there are a few loops you go around and but you can't grab the rings around the loop.

I still think you should get rid of that hit back after you hit the wall. Like I said it was only in Sonic 2 beta for a reason its no good.

I'm not a big fan of adding badniks to the boss it seems kinda like a quick fix that really doesn't work well. I would suggest just going back and rethinking that first boss.

Also some more gimmicks would be nice I you said you added some but I don't really see any. Unless that hoop that shoots you through is what you are talking about. Gimmicks should be a little more original then that anyway I'd say.

The level design still need a major overhaul you added more but you didn't fix what was already there.

Overall I would say this is a better then average game that could really turn into a great game.

[Spike]

Oh yeah, I meant to get rid of some of the enemies and fix that loop where you don't actually get some of the rings, but my girlfriend called me to go out at the very last minute, so I shot the demo out as fast as I could to make sure it was out for the last night of SAGE.

Thanks though. I hope this will turn into one of the big name games.

[Ashes Darkmare]

Some reason when I start the first act the sceen blackens and only the timer and score and rings can be seen and the life icon on the bottom no background, black can't see the sprites I don't get it X.x and I can't do anything

[Spike]

That happens sometimes, it's just typical slowdown. Wait it out.

As of yesterday, I have been adding Xbox 360 controller support (Other gamepads will work, but the main focus is the wired 360 controller). Coming along nicely.

[Ashes Darkmare]

That happens sometimes, it's just typical slowdown. Wait it out.

As of yesterday, I have been adding Xbox 360 controller support (Other gamepads will work, but the main focus is the wired 360 controller). Coming along nicely.

That made my day right there! I have a Xbox360 and I love that very much

[Spike]

Glad to hear it! I was wondering if anyone would use it, but that cleared things up.

[Rael0505]

I played the first demo you released during SAGE, but this is my first time playing the final demo. Thoughts while playing:

-The camera should never go above the ground when Sonic jumps. Fix the camera so you can still see where you're landing.

-When Sonic jumps, the shield isn't centered on him anymore.

-When Sonic rolls up a half pipe, he should still be rolling while in the air.

-I like the Sonic sprite, nice shading and colors. The backgrounds are decent too, although the palmtree trunks should be brown and not green (I know you're partially colorblind, I'd be willing to recolor them for you).

-I like the originality of the special stages, even if they're pretty hard to control. I'm sure I could get used to it the way I got used to all Sonic 3's.

-Spindash is weak. If you're not going to let him rev up multiple times, increase the power of the spindash.

-I liked the surfing part, but it got old pretty fast. I think it could've ended earlier if you couldn't put anything else original into it (badniks or something?) and take him back to land.

-I'm in act 3. Sonic can wall jump? It's kind of hard to use, make Sonic jump higher with each jump. It's annoying to try to move up with it.

-Tough boss, I barely won. Sonic's speed needs to reverse when he hits the boss, because almost every time I'd hit him, he'd hit me back. Other than that, it seems fine.

Good demo, I enjoyed it. The levels weren't horrible, but they were bland. You need more gimmicks and fewer hold right parts. The surfing part was a great break from the regular parts of the level. I think they should be smaller too, if you can't find a way to make them less repetative. Very fun game overall, I look forward to the next demo.

[Spike]

Thanks, I figured that this topic was dead.

Two things, the surfing part was so plain because that's all I could get done in one day. I basically just told Huepow "So i got this idea for a minigame, should I put the demo off for one more day to get it done?" and we both agreed that it might go over well. It's not quite finished, though.

You hold down the spindash to charge it. One touch, no revving.

[Rael0505]

Oh, really? That makes sense.

The surfing part wasn't bad. Just revise it a little for the next demo.

[Huepow00]

The surfing part was just slow, and easy...

It needs to be alot faster...

[Rael0505]

I don't think it needs to be any faster. It's only the first level, it shouldn't be hard. It just needs to be interesting.

[CrypticSailor]

Finally got to play this thing! I have to say, it did exceed my expectations(being I have never played anything that you've done). I must agree with all of the comments Rael made. Aside from that, there are a few other things I have a problem with:

- It seems still pretty glitchy. I am overlooking it a bit because I know we had SAGE, which is a big deadline for fangamers >_< An example of a small glitch(which there are a few all over.. but I have a lot of HW to make up atm ), is at the "Act Cleared" screen; Tails can still jump as if following the player's movement. Maybe you can fix this by sensing sonic's actual jump algorithm instead of the keys that cause it(Would help the AI to program things this way, as well).

- Variable jump... please? Considering how many jumps there were from platform to platform(and how the levels are spaced out), this would have helped the feeling *greatly*.

- Level design/bgs could use a little bit of work... The whole stage didn't seem to have the same sort of pallete/lighting to it.. I dunno. For example, as somebody mentioned, the palmtrees were extremely green As for the level design, too many damn ramps! >_<... I don't know if it's just me but maybe he should lose just a little bit less velocity on them since they're so often(makes parts of the stage feel tedious).

-The camera man... it's pretty bad at times... It was the first thing I noticed when I jumped after starting the game!(Maybe a misarrangement of events) Not to mention when rotating angles while spindashing, it only locks the horizontal view so you still don't see infront of you on ramps

-The wasp enemies... are retarded. You need to take advantage of the Y axis when doing their AI (At least a circular down->up->down pattern to keep things a little interesting). They didnt seem to match, graphic-wise either.

I also kind of am urked by the name. "Sonic 4" itself is fine, but the fact is it is pretty unpolished compared to a lot of projects to go calling it "Sonic 4"... not to mention a lot of edited sprites/backgrounds for good measure. I don't think if the quality literally isn't near or better than the real thing, it can possibly be named as a sequel. Just gives me a n00bish vibe ... which is odd because this is pretty damn decent. Maybe you should consider giving yourself a subtitle to distinguish it from the other "SONIC THE HEDGEHOG 4"S .... This is the reason when me and Cinos worked on the really old project "Sonic 4: Corrupted Chaos", we included a subtitle. It's kind of just a fanboy issue I have with a plain name like "sonic 4" ... Kinda like the speedy gonzalez hack for SNES being considered a Sonic game later on by many emulation sites. That's just my personal opinion about it, as ass-ish as that sounds.

Now, I know I'm being a super nitpick fuck... so I will give you some pros that I notice which distinguish this project:

* The acts are long... I couldn't believe I had only passed the first act after finally fighting Nack. I will try to say this is a good thing(since most fangames, let alone the sonic games themselves last this long), but hopefully you won't have Puzzle or difficult water stages later on whre you can't save in between acts ;P

*Tails works ... Rare as well lol.

* The music for the boss is awesome! suits the purpose, since you are

naming the game "Sonic 4" and I notice the cheesy early 90s samples

* Nice extras. The surfing part(though you couldve added more to the gfx effects) was a refreshing change. The Special Stage was pretty damn cool as well. It really did seem like something Sega would have thrown in if there were a sequel to S3 ...

* Overall, this is [one of] the best efforts I've seen for a fangame. I could tell you put in a ton of hours and it shows.

Aside from my nitpicks, and my problem with the name, good job! *props*

[Spike]

Wow, I totally missed your review. For some reason, the forum still said Rael was the last to post. Oh well.

Thanks for the comments, I know level design is a big issue, so I am going over and making the Levels more like Sonic 1-3, rather than whatever the hell I was going for. (Most of the two acts were done months ago, and I really have learned a lot about level design since then). Oh, and what is a Variable Jump?

EDIT: Forgot something. With or without a subtitle, it still says "Sonic 4". Seems really petty.

[CrypticSailor]

The Sonic 4 gripe I have dates back to 10 yrs ago with tons of n00bs on forums going "OMGZ ITS TEH SONIC 4!!11"(though obviously you arent' one of those cases. It just reminds me of them )... the argument against these people was that "it takes no thought or originality to come up with the name of Sonic 4".That and it isn't the official sequel(which may one day be a possibility). With a subtitle, it's distinguished. It's name isn't trying to *just* be a continuation of a classic series but more of it's own thing(since let's face it, I doubt even the best of the best can really make a better overall game than Sonic 3 here since we're hobbyists who don't do this for a living). Your game does seem to have it's own feel, afterall. I personally don't like reffering to a game as "Sonic 4" that isn't actually Sonic 4. Like I said, this is *still* one of the best fangames, but this is my opinion. I'm only trying to help and give you an idea of my impression on it, so I hope you're not offended.

As for variable jump- it's pretty much when you control how high you jump based on how long you press the jump button. If you let go earlier, the jump is lower. It gives you more of a feeling of direct control. Since sonic is a fast game, it also helps in a lot of cases. For example if you want to destroy a bot while running forward and he's about at the edge of the screen(and you're in the middle), you might want to enjoy bashing it with a low jump to bounce onto something else ... or maybe you want to avoid a ceiling spike but you still need to jump accross something(because there's also a hole in front of you). Since buttons are binary, you can't really determine how high you jump based on how hard you press a button, so they have to gauge the jumps somehow. It's been in pretty much most platform games(Including Sonic, Megaman, Mario, Metroid, etc) since the NES days. Most people don't believe me, but I just played Megaman 4 last week

[Spike]

Oh, I see. While new Sonic games do use that jump, I don't remember the Genesis/CD/32X games using it. Correct me if I am wrong.

I was thinking of a new title, but my game really got recognized at SAGE. It would confuse many people to change it now.

[Rael0505]

Every Sonic game used the "variable jump." In fact, I can't think of any platformer off the top of my head that I've played that doesn't use it. I really agree with DarkS, you should implement it.

DarkS: Are you RC? RC sent me the opening cutscene for his game Sonic 4: Corrupted Chaos (with the death egg exploding and sonic losing his emeralds or whatever with the stratovarius music in the background, very similar to Sonic XG).

[Kain]

Every Sonic game used the "variable jump." In fact, I can't think of any platformer off the top of my head that I've played that doesn't use it.

Kirby Superstar's the only one I can think of and it's not that much a deal since kirby can fly.

Anyway it's a simple matter to implement. Just have it if Sonic releases the jump button before he naturally slows down to bellow a certain vertical speed (say -3), then set his vertical speed to that. There are other ways to do it, but I think that's the most common.

[Spike]

I know how to do it. I just never implimented it because I thought that the classic games didn't use it. Oh well, I'll put it in there.

[Huepow00]

* The music for the boss is awesome! suits the purpose, since you are

naming the game "Sonic 4" and I notice the cheesy early 90s samples

Your quite welcome

(yay I made decent music!)