Sonic Adventure 2 – Everything that is bad in a Sonic game

[P3DR0]

Haters gonna hate.

Back in the beginning of the 21st century, a new Sonic game has been launched, it was the sequel of the first 3D Sonic game, Sonic Adventure.

The title was Sonic Adventure 2, and since the time ‘til now, the game is claimed by many as the best Sonic game ever created. The concept was new, was fresh… Was shitty.

I’ll explain here, how Sonic Adventure 2 ruined Sonic’s next titles:

(May have spoilers, read by your own risk)

Dark/Complicated story, bro.

It isn’t new that Sonic tries to stay away from complicated stories without much twists and turns, but recently, Sonic games started to look a little too much deep… Guess where it began? Since Adventure 2.

Sonic Heroes and all of that “Shadow cloning” stuff was kinda of dark for that happy story, after all it kinda implied (at least for me) that Shadow was dead and all this time you were playing with an android. That’s why it was only shown at the end of the game.

Shadow the Hedgehog by itself was a game who tried to create a dark plot, with chaos, dead people and… Ugh… Monsters. I guess I don’t need to enter further on this one, just keep in mind: Dark story.

Sonic 2006 a game that involves monsters killing our blue hedgehog, a silver hedgehog from the future speaking of killing a “Iblis Trigger”… Guess who… our blue hedgehog. Involves the end of the world, monsters, etcetera. It’s shitty as can be.

Sonic and the Secret Rings this one was kinda less dark, but still had some pretty bizarre monsters, a guy destroying a whole story (which you can say that it’s destroying some lifes as well since it was a “alive story”) and your friend who is killed in the end. Ok that it’s just fantasy, but still isn’t the pretty and colored story from the classic games.

Sonic Unleashed a giant demon who lives at the center of the earth and it’s possessing people around the globe that was shattered by an evil genius and our hero suffer from this curse as well, becoming a werewolf at the night.

Sonic and the Black Knight an evil king rises and start ruling the land by the worst way possible, our hero have to fight with him and after destroying him, he finds out that the friend who was helping him since the beginning was the one who holds all the guilty for all of this.

Sonic 4 and Sonic Colors has broken this cycle.

But still, I’m kinda scared at Generations and this whole “Time Eater” thing. The name isn’t friendly anyway, and SEGA has announced that will be a new enemy so… New robot or new monster? (With SEGA’s portfolio I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s a monster).

Ok, so what does this have to do with Sonic Adventure 2 sucking? Sonic Adventure 2 was the first Sonic game who presented a complicated/dark story. Ok that Sonic Adventure had that whole thing of a monster destroying City Square, but still had more class and was less scary than Biolizard and all of SA2’s story. Military forces chasing you, a dark past revealed, destruction of the world, an new enemy, betrayal, teenagers dying (Maria), and an rival, an enemy who in the end becomes your friend, who is dead in the end. “Sayonara, Shadow the Hedgehog”.

Boy what’s with all this mess? Why can’t we have an simple story like Robotnik creating a masterplan to destroy the world and Sonic foiling his plans? Thankfully that’s what happened in Sonic Colors.

Moving on…

”Invisible walls everywhere” and “Can I play a little bit with Sonic now, please?”

What was the main complains about Sonic games in this modern era? “Invisible walls, invisible walls everywhere!” and "linear level design".

Ok I do understand the need of setting some bounds for the player don’t fuck up with the game or to avoid glitches (open-world type of games are the most glitchy games around). And guess where this started? Sonic Adventure 2.

Sonic Adventure 1 was beautiful, you could go anywhere on the map, explore… You saw the lighthouse, and you could go there! It was a fantastic idea! You could play the game making a speedrun, ignoring the level and exploration and just running as fast as you can just to get to the end of the stage, it was optional, the player had the power of choice, the player could play the game that he wanted to play.

But Sonic Adventure 2 of course, raped this idea and made a “speed-run from point A to B” with Sonic and Shadow, copied the Treasure Hunt from Sonic Adventure 1 with Knuckles and Rouge, just making the levels worst and smaller (except for Pumpkin Hill). And finally, added a boring mechanic for Tails and Robotnik, which could be resumed as: Sonic and Shadow’s point A to B game scheme, just slower as hell with E-102 Gamma shooter scheme.

And even worst, it forced the player to play with the other characters instead of the Sonic Adventure scheme where the player choose the character and play his whole story… No. You have to play with Tails/Robotnik and Knuckles/Rouge first to be able to play with Sonic/Shadow. And most of the time the game doesn’t even follow the chronologic order! Making you play with Sonic, Tails, Knuckles, Tails, Sonic, Sonic, Knuckles, Tails, Knuckles, Tails, Knuckles, Sonic…

And I do remember another game who forced me play with characters that I didn’t wanted to play… Sonic motherfucking Unleashed. Yeah, you know those three levels with five~ten minutes long with Werehog before you play with Sonic? Guess from where SEGA had picked up this idea? And what about in Sonic 2006 where you had other characters in the level who changes the gameplay drastically making you play with them… I wonder, where did SEGA picked up this fucked up idea too… Oh yeah, Sonic Adventure 2.

Rawr… I’m a motherfucking monster and I'm going to rape everyone in your family

Ok, this item isn’t really Sonic Adventure 2 fault, it was Sonic Adventure’s fault. But hey, Sonic Adventure 2 kept the idea of a monster being the final boss of the game, and since Sonic Adventure 2 was claimed by 80% of the fans as the best Sonic ever, this probably gave SEGA the idea that they were going on the right track making giant enemies who says to Robotnik at the end: “Hey dude, look at the size of my cock. Thanks for all the efforts on making me a giant killing machine, but now go fuck yourself.”

Well, they must have thought that was a good idea since later on we had Metal Overlord, Iblis/Solaris, Dark Gaia, Alf-Laya Lyla (I don’t fucking know how is he called), Merlina Something-Queen (same here). Ok that we can’t blame Sonic Adventue 2 entirely, Sonic Adventure has his part of guilty but hey, after winning two times it kinda makes you think that you’re doing it right. No? So thank you for that, SA2.

In the end, Sonic Adventure 2 is a shitty game who’s defended by nostalgia’s sake. It was made back in the time where Sonic didn’t used to fail much, so mistakes were tolerated. But it was SA2 who threw the snowball downhill. And like on any good cartoon, it was getting bigger, bigger, bigger, and finally it came and made a strike in our hopes and dreams.

I often see people complaining “Why don’t they make a game like Sonic Adventure? :/”

Well they actually did it, it’s called Sonic 2006/Sonic Next-Gen/Sonic the Hedgehog.

It has one of the lost factors since Sonic Adventure 2: The exploration. All the levels were open and you could even enter other characters sections. It also had another Sonic Adventure lost feature: You could select with who you wanted to play. Ok that it forces you to change it in the middle of level, but still, you’re playing just your character’s story.

And the only reason that Sonic 2006 was a bad game, was because it tried to be a Sonic Adventure 3, picking up the “best” elements for both Sonic Adventures.

From Sonic Adventure 1: The exploration, level design, character selection and the hub worlds (which were oddly fun at Adventure 1).

From Sonic Adventure 2: The story.

And what are the most ridiculous and hatted elements at Sonic 2006?

The story and the glitches.

Now, the game was rushed, and that’s what caused most of the glitches. But what’s the excuse of the story?... Oh yeah, Sonic Adventure 2 had a similar one.

But hey, at least Sonic never disappointed us at the music and graphics.

[Delta Hedgehog]

Is creating an entire thread just so you can hate on a relatively good game really all that necessary? I understand that everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but come on.

[P3DR0]

Is creating an entire thread just so you can hate on a relatively good game really all that necessary? I understand that everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but come on.

It's a thesis, and the entire thread is the proof for it, what holds the idea. I could say "I don't like this game because it ruined the entire Sonic saga" but people would ask me "Where is your proof for that?"

I say,

"Here is my proof motherfucker, analyze this and see if I don't have reason."

[Dark Raven X]

Nope.

If I need to make that longer to make it more 'apt' a response, then;

Nope.

So you prefer the older games. That's cool. So do I. But to say the Adventure era was all bad is just nuts. And to be honest, this is the first I've seen of people trying to place SA1 over SA2.

I get the impression SA2 has now reached the point where it's so popular that it's now cool to hate it, ala FFVII, and legitimate criticisms get inflated to such a proportion that they eclipse all the other problems other games in the series have had...

[Kirs]

Maybe you have reason, all you said have sense but.. i enjoyed SA2 a lot

[P3DR0]

I'm not saying that SA2 is a bad game by itself. All I'm saying is that he's the one who started to make Sonic flow in the wrong direction.

I personally don't like it, but you can enjoy it, no problems. But what you can't do is negate that all of this makes perfectly sense and it's kinda of true.

[luksamuk]

I like SA2 and Sonic Heroes. I liked the concept of 2006 (yeah, that whole demons and gods shit). Never played Black Knight neither Secret Rings. And Sonic Unleashed (the HD version) is fascinating. Even the Werehog everyone complained and I don't know why people hate the X360/PS3 version of him. It's like everybody hates beat-em-ups like God of War.

But yeah, this is not the point. So you don't like the fact that Sonic is gitting into a more adult thematic.

The thing is: SEGA still worries about its fanbase. They're making adult thematics because people who played Sonic 1 is around 25 years old now. And they prefer leaving Sonic behind to play some Call of Duty [this is why they made a semi-shooter crappy Shadow game].

But I personally don't see a problem with this adult thematic. I mean, if you look at Unleashed's story, where SEGA started getting back to the childish thematic, Eggman never meant to kill Sonic. He builds his giant machines, bosses and whatever to be beaten by Sonic always, because that's what he do.

But when you analyze the personality of Eggman in Sonic 2006, he REALLY intends to make a ditactorial empire and wouldn't stare at anything. And Sonic, well, it's his "beloved" archenemy that he'd also like to KILL at any costs. SO, I SAY, this is kinda the approach to a real life Sonic.

And Demons like Dark Gaia and Gods like Solaris are just part of the mentality of this century - maybe even the millenium. We're surrounded with information about the world's end, and that Apocalipse shit. And that just started in 2000. And it IS an interesting plot to base on because there's too much stories to explore in it. Dark games make so damn crazy money. Take a look at The Force Unleashed, LIMBO, Alan Wake, and this new Insanely Twisted Shadow Planet... and even take a look at this Lost Hope Zone thing I'm making. People like it, because it's different. Even children now likes darkish cartoons.

[Dark Raven X]

Flipside, of course, LH, is that the bright colourful lighthearted Sonic Colours eschewed all of those conventions and turned out to be what is considered the best of the modern games. Generations looks to be in the same vein as Colours, so I couldn't be more excited for it. >

[P3DR0]

The problem with it, LH, is that Alan Wake, Limbo, Force Unleashed, etc... Are games that were created with the whole concept of beeing dark.

And SEGA were trying to modificate Sonic to be dark and dude, no! It's almost like Nintendo while were doing Mario Galaxy (which is one of the games that most change Mario's mechanics) said "Hm, Mario is on the space now, let's be realistic, let's make his head explode when he is out of any atmosphere, let's make giant aliens like Crysis that shoots everyone and kills Mario at some point of the game."

You would think "What the fuck is that game?". The game has his essence setted already, you can't change that. In the same way, Sonic have to be surreal, childish, colorful and funny. This is Sonic's essence.

The proof that the "adult themes" on Sonic were a bad idea is Generations by itself. The old fans didn't liked the adult theme so SEGA needed to bring back classic Sonic and all of his essence to please those mature fans.

Those fans left Sonic to play Call of Duty, not because was too childish, but because it was just too much "adult". Like "Fuck, if I wanna play Call of Duty, I play Call of Duty, damn SEGA."

Look at Colors, is the best Modern Sonic game so far and have the most "childish" theme since the classic games. And it's also loved by the old fans and the new fans. But 2006... Sorry, but I've only seen 10~12yo kids on Youtube saying "hurr I lube this gaem xD elise is so hot xDD".

[Caleb]

I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU!! You're the FIRST person I've ever seen hate on SA2. That game was completely horrific. I'd rather go play 06, at least I can actually play as Sonic for a decent amount of time. The gameplay is broken, the story was idiotic, as was the characters, and the fact that Tails had a Mech and you could play as Eggman was just stupid.

[luksamuk]

I have to agree. Sonic never meant to go this way... But he did it. Yeah, that's right. It should come back to the colorful atmosphere, yes.

About 2006, I just HATE IT, but not more than Shadow the Hedgehog because it HAS and interesting concept behind it.

Unfortunately, that's just the concept. And yeah, maybe this concept wasn't supposed to be mixed with Sonic.

EDIT: Talking about SA2, I, well... like the levels, except Knuckles'. Won't talk about its story. I dunno, just... idk. City Esape is definitely an awesome SEGA's choice. Specially the Modern part.

[1LT Worm]

The title was Sonic Adventure 2, and since the time ‘til now, the game is claimed by many as the best Sonic game ever created.

[...]

ince Sonic Adventure 2 was claimed by 80% of the fans as the best Sonic ever.

Um, yeah...I'm going to have to call shenanigans and ask you for your source on that one.

It wasn't a terrible game, although I have nightmares from those Tails / Robotnik levels where the only way to get an A was collect all the rings and kill everything, BUT OH SHIT! You get hit about once every three seconds. (its ok cuz u have a shield gauge lol)

[Duckboy]

Sonic 4 didn't break any cycle. It was garbage.

Agreed on Colors though.

[Sparks]

Here's why Sonic Adventure 2 sucks:

>Green Forest

>Going straight in those tree trunk things

>Still somehow veer left and fall off

how does that even work

[Dark Raven X]

White Jungle was the best.

EDIT: Sorry, meant to say the best.

What I'm getting at here, is White Jungle is super awesome.

[P3DR0]

Sonic 4 didn't break any cycle. It was garbage.

Agreed on Colors though.

Sonic 4 broke the cycle in the aspect of "complicated story".

[Delta Hedgehog]

I will say this, the Kart Racing stages can suck my dick.

[Sparks]

White Jungle was the best.

EDIT: Sorry, meant to say the best.

What I'm getting at here, is White Jungle is super awesome.

I had the same problem in White Jungle (oh that Multiplayer).

[Dark Raven X]

I seem to recall before it came out that it was gonna have a storyline about Sonic travelling the world after defeating Eggman during S3&K. It might have even implied Eggman died in space or something. Then none of this was alluded to in game at all. @__@

[DJ espeed]

To be honest: Sonic Adventure 2 is one of my favorite games, but I agree on some of the points brought up. It was like an unnecessary decrescendo to Adventure's crescendo. And frankly, it didn't end with just SA2. Heroes (which I think somewhat highly of) took it lower. And then we had shit games like Shadow and 06. I like the former somewhat for it's level progression based on what 'mission' you finished, granted your levels had more of a linear, non-branching path. Unleashed was alright in my eyes, but the werehog killed it for me. I tried out the Wii version (and oddly enough, that's the only version of the game I have left as I sold my Xbox version), and I just thought that was worse. Then came 4. I was like, 'alright', but the lingering problems with the movements and visuals made it seem like a crappy straight-to-video sequel to a blockbuster film. Colors, which I tried and progressed through recently, was the crescendo in the series I had been looking for. They built upon Unleashed's daytime mechanics and added some gimmicks that (in my opinion) enhanced the level design. I loved that game out of the more recent outings. As a matter of fact, I think it was by far, the most fun Sonic game I've ever played in years.

But anywho, Sonic Adventure 2 is still a good game in my eyes, despite it's problems.

[MrChidna]

SA2 did have a lot of problems, I think. It was kinda buggy, (At least in the Gamecube version. Did anyone else have that weird glitch where Sonic went straight into a jumpdash rather than actually jumping on Egg Golem?) and Knuckles and Rouge's levels were completely disgustingly bad. The only redeeming part of THOSE were Rouge's classy acid-jazz BGM. Tails and Robotnik were fun to play as, but I can see where you're coming from.

Plus it ushered in the new generation of "OMG KAWAII SHIPPING XDDDDDD" crowd of elitist fangirls thanks to Shadow, but that's not really a point against the game itself. (You should've stayed dead, dammit.)

Sonic Adventure 2 was allright, but the people who say it's the best game ever are wrong. That award goes to Sonic 3.

PS: Using Sonic 4 as a case in any argument is not a good idea. That game was an overglorified remake of Sonic Pocket Adventure.

[Sparks]

PS: Using Sonic 4 as a case in any argument is not a good idea. That game was an overglorified remake of Sonic Pocket Adventure.

I'd play Pocket Adventure over Sonic 4 any day. At least it has momentum, decent level layout, and original bosses.

Yeah I'm still that old Pocket fanboy at heart.

[tentril]

Personally I thought the story was more complicated in Sonic Adventure. Evil water monster stuck in the Master Emerald that broke out once a thousand years ago and Knuckles time travels to figure it out so you can stop it with the help of Tikal and the Chao. Oh yeah and Big is here too.

Sonic Adventure 2 was just Shadow wanting revenge for Maria's death even though she told him not to do that. Oops. The most complicated thing was trying to figure out how people thought he was Sonic. Especially when Sonic was in the same place as him so often.

[The ParadoxX]

I'd play Pocket Adventure over Sonic 4 any day. At least it has momentum, decent level layout, and original bosses.

Yeah I'm still that old Pocket fanboy at heart.

That's not fanboyism, Pocket Adventure is far superior than Sonic 4.

About Sonic Adventure 2: as I said once to you, I may agree with some of your arguments, but many of them could be applied to SA1:

- SA1 had a complicated and dark story too - both great IMO, in fact, I don't think that storyline is the biggest issue with the next-gen games.

- Being forced to play with other characters is really annoying, but to finish SA1 you had to play with boring characters as well.

- SA1 levels are as linear as SA2 levels. SA2 just feels more linear because sonic moves faster with the new grind and tricks stuff.

I think that everything that's wrong nowadays started with SA1, and the next games just fucked it up even more. But there are many elements of the next-gen gameplay that are fun, that's why I still like SA2. It may not be perfect, but to me is the best 3D Sonic game, SA1 in second (I haven't played anything after Shadow the Hedgehog though).

[luksamuk]

(I haven't played anything after Shadow the Hedgehog though).

Colors and Unleashed would be worth your gameplay. And maybe Generations.