Sonic 4 Thread

[Slingerland]

Sonic 4 - What's In A Name?

I've written this article mostly from my fangame creation experience, plus the respect that I have for the classic games. Jamie Bailey even came over to say "hi" and then some (I was taken aback by his appearance, as TSS isn't the home of classic Sonic fans). Thanks again for stopping by, Jamie. I hold your opinion in high regard (I can't imagine someone who doesn't, really).

I'm getting dogpiled for obvious reasons, but many of us felt in the #retro chat room that someone had to sack up and say something. I could give a fuck about new___ backlash. Long story short: don't call shit "Sonic 4." Leave a comment. Support the nation.

[tentril]

Good article, and I totally agree. Since we have nothing to go on but how it looks, new style Sonic is like a slap in the face. Its a statement that they aren't really trying for old-school.

[Pheonix Gamma]

The thing is, Sega uses the new Sonic to market their iPhone port of the original game. Imagine my confusion when I went looking for it on the app store, only to be greeted by that smug piece of shit. Actually, they've used new Sonic for all of their classic ports, like the Collections for the last gen of consoles, and the promo thing for the Sonic collection on DS or whatever the fuck that was.

That pretty much tells me that Old Sonic saw his Shadow and ran back into his Knothole for good.

EDIT: Here you go, Brad:

http://forums.sega.com/showpost.php?p=5534383&postcount=1

Hello everyone!

Today we have some good news to bring you guys in regard to Sonic's running animation in Sonic the Hedgehog 4 Episode I! Specifically, we wanted to cover a topic that many of you have asked about after seeing the trailer.

Q: Is the running animation in the trailer what Sonic's fastest running animation will look like in Sonic the Hedgehog 4? It looks kind of slow, don't you think?

A: Actually, it is not his fastest speed! There is a faster animation for Sonic's running that was not shown in the trailer, and is more akin to what you might be familiar seeing from Sonic 3 & Knuckles or Sonic CD.

So there you have it! We'll get to show you guys firsthand what that running animation looks like in the future - but until then, rest assured that there's a lot more to the game than what you saw in the trailer: running animations included.

Have a great weekend,

Ruby

[Jamie Bailey]

HONEY, I'M HOME! And I've dragged my opinions back with me, all the way from the Stadium, so they can be viewed in what I still consider my internet home, SFGHQ, where they should be!

"Jamie Bailey (Yes, he's been Time Attacked!) says:

6 February, 2010 at 3:21 pm

Brilliant article! This is the problem with us old school Sonic fans, we’re far too hardcore and sincere for our own good, we’ve stuck with Sonic through his modern evolution, through thick and thin, through the good games and bad games, some of us have spent silly amounts of time creating our own fangame versions of Sonic while others have dedicated their time to finding every miniscule secret of those old games we loved so much. We’ve stayed through many things that haven’t been to our taste, but somehow, after all these years, the true old school Sonic fans still haven’t given up… and never will by the looks of it.

Though looking at what we’ve seen of Project Needlemouse so far just as a new Sonic game, it’s fine, but looking at it from an old school fan’s perspective (which is what I am), SEGA royally set themselves up with this one. Even though they never actually said the words, they strongly implied that this would be 100% classic styled. September’s teaser trailer showed a sillhouette of the Sonic 1 title image, complete with the shape of the classic style Sonic, so for FIVE MONTHS, we’ve “known” that this game would feature a classic looking Sonic, and although the colour of Sonic’s eyes aren’t going to make any difference to how the game plays, any Sonic fan who grew up during the 16-bit era will know, there was just something magical about Sonic’s original look, a certain charm you don’t see in his modern design, he never used to have that cocky teenager “attitude” look. So that’s a bit of a slap in the face to old school fans expecting Sonic’s classic look.

And I agree with the naming thing. I admit, I didn’t think SEGA were daft enough to use that name, as it’s something many old school fans have dreamed of since finishing Sonic & Knuckles, it’s a name that implies this game is specifically being made for the old school fans, so SEGA HAD to match old school fan expectations perfectly with no modern twists like the homing attack or a new school Sonic, which wouldn’t matter if they gave it a different title, Sonic the Hedgehog 2D HD or something would have been a sufficient title. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t dislike the homing attack, I don’t mind them updating Sonic’s look for modern styled Sonic games because times change and you have to update, I liked the Sonic Advance and Sonic Rush series. Hell, I myself even created a Sonic Fangame with grinding in it, but the name Sonic the Hedgehog 4 itself specifically tells us this is (or should be) 100% old school styled, and should entirely satisfy that old dream.

More positively though, once I got over the initial shock, I found I’m massively looking forward to the game(s), I’m not keen on this episodic business, but I could easily forgive SEGA if all the episodes can be locked together to make one uber game, Sonic 3 & Knuckles style or if each episode feels like a full length game by classic Sonic standards, or if they manage both, it would be “epic win”. I expected the fist zone to have a few Green Hill Zone squares here and there, but I didn’t think they’d make the whole ground design with them. But still, though they didn’t quite go 100% old school, there is a lot of old school look to this game, and I can’t wait to play it.

Now this is my third Stadium post in a row and I’m starting to feel a bit misplaced from my SFGHQ home."

"Brad Flick says:

6 February, 2010 at 3:36 pm

I would have never expected to see you over here, Jamie. Thanks for that surprise!"

"Jamie Bailey (Yes, he's been Time Attacked!) says:

6 February, 2010 at 4:08 pm

I’ve kind of been drawn here a lot recently with all the Sega All Stars Racing and Needlemouse info coming out (and leaking out, for that matter) and for some reason, in my unwell state, I seem to have begun posting here too, although it looks like my “reply” up there is practically an article in itself and I’m now realising this one is more of a forum chat type post, guess I can’t do anything right, LOL._

Even if we do nitpick when SEGA tries to please us, classic Sonic fans = Absolute, bloody legends. I chose my favourite internet community well!"

Oh, and one more thing...

*Dogpiles Slingerland*

[Cyber Rat]

That's a very good article Brad, you make some good points.

Regarding the Homing Attack, while I get that it doesn't have much of a purpose in a 2D plane, you have to keep in mind this:

Sonic 1 = Run and jump

Sonic 2 = Run, jump, spindash

Sonic 3&K = Run, jump, spindash, shield abilities

Technically, a new mechanic wouldn't be that bad an idea for a Sonic 4, you just have to argue whether it should have been a homing attack or something else.

As for the visuals, I thought BlazBlue proved that 2D HD is superior...

[Zenor]

At who is SEGA/Sonic team aiming to get attention from? The "Old" Sonic fans, or the "New" Sonic fans?

Calling this "Sonic 4" without bringing what made the previous games so great, and completely missing the point of what is a "Classic" game is enough just to consider this a "slap in the face", like Tentril said. If this is supposed to be a direct sequel from Sonic3&K, I'd like at least some continuity and the new content like what each game brought. They hyped us a lot, calling this to be a game that would bring Sonic "back to the roots" - But they really didn't do that. It's just another Sonic Rush or whatever you want to call it, but it's not a "Classic" sequel.

Preposterous.

I'm not ungrateful- I'm upset. Because we already got a game like that.

Technically, a new mechanic wouldn't be that bad an idea for a Sonic 4, you just have to argue whether it should have been a homing attack or something else.

You know what did homing attack well? Sonic 3D Blast. Despite the terrible flickies mechanic that didn't let me enjoy it as I'd like to have, that was done right.

The thing is, Sega uses the new Sonic to market their iPhone port of the original game. Imagine my confusion when I went looking for it on the app store, only to be greeted by that smug piece of shit. Actually, they've used new Sonic for all of their classic ports, like the Collections for the last gen of consoles, and the promo thing for the Sonic collection on DS or whatever the fuck that was.

That pretty much tells me that Old Sonic saw his Shadow and ran back into his Knothole for good.

There's something wrong with SEGA, it looks as though as if it hates Classic Sonic - Or can't get money without having to resort to the new Sonic fans.

EDIT: Here you go, Brad:

http://forums.sega.com/showpost.php?p=5534383&postcount=1

It goes even faster? Great. Just what you'd expect from a Next Gen Sonic game.

[DimensionWarped]

you just have to argue whether it should have been a homing attack or something else.

Something else. My argument? Whats cooler?

or

And don't you dare accuse me of deliberately making the lines for the regular bounces prettier!

[Pheonix Gamma]

That's a very good article Brad, you make some good points.

Regarding the Homing Attack, while I get that it doesn't have much of a purpose in a 2D plane, you have to keep in mind this:

Sonic 1 = Run and jump

Sonic 2 = Run, jump, spindash

Sonic 3&K = Run, jump, spindash, shield abilities

Technically, a new mechanic wouldn't be that bad an idea for a Sonic 4, you just have to argue whether it should have been a homing attack or something else.

As for the visuals, I thought BlazBlue proved that 2D HD is superior...

Sonic 4 = Wall jump. Sonic becomes more mobile, but still requires skill to make use of the ability as opposed to pressing a button twice and closing your eyes. If you keep him balled up like classic Sonic, it'd look like he was just bouncing off the wall(s). Which would be cool.

Bam. Game Design.

[DimensionWarped]

DW no like wall jump. Wall jump take away fancy climby climby from gimmick. It's better than homing attack though.

[Cyber Rat]

Sonic 4 = Wall jump. Sonic becomes more mobile, but still requires skill to make use of the ability as opposed to pressing a button twice and closing your eyes. If you keep him balled up like classic Sonic, it'd look like he was just bouncing off the wall(s). Which would be cool.

Bam. Game Design.

A wall jump would be awesome if done properly.

@DW: But the lines in the first picture are prettier...

[DimensionWarped]

Yes, but thats not because of my personal biases, it's because homing attack is just that shit. BELIEVE IT! *shivers as shitty reference wraiths descend upon him*

[Pheonix Gamma]

DW no like wall jump. Wall jump take away fancy climby climby from gimmick. It's better than homing attack though.

Climby? Climby?

I just want to see Sonic sprint at a wall full tilt and bounce off that shit. I wouldn't make it silly like Mega Man X's magical "I gravitate towards walls because robotz" climb.

You know, something like the Mario games. I hear him and Sonic used to be rivals or something.

[DimensionWarped]

Mario games don't just bounce off the wall, they bounce up and off the wall. So yes, climby climby. I suppose it wouldn't be so bad, but you'd pretty much have to forgo climbs up narrow cooridors if you wanted to do it that way.

Now, if it really were just bounce laterally off the wall, that could be pretty neat. Like you jump down a pit, slide quickly down the wall (only slowing your natural acceleration, not stopping it and especially not reducing setting your speed to some slow value) and then you jump and go perfeclty sideways? Yeah, that'd be tight.

[Serephim]

they just need to keep it simple. No more of that "RPG Elements" shit because they suck at it.

If this game is minus playable Super Sonic then it is not Sonic 4.

[Cyber Rat]

Now that you've mentioned Super Sonic...

PLEASE DON'T REMAKE DOOMSDAY ZONE! I loved that level, but it will feel so cheap remaking it...

[Blyde]

God dammit DW. I was hoping never to hear that phrase again.

Good read, Brad. I agree wholeheartedly with the name segment: if it weren't Sonic 4, I'd be more accepting of this. But with a name like Sonic the Hedgehog 4, I expected so much more. And I'd much rather see some hi-res 2D art or something for the logo instead of another generic piece of CG.

But I'll be ever so cheesed if they decide to make the homing attack a mandatory segment of levels... AKA bottomless pit of death under a string of enemies. The level design better not suck balls at least.

[tentril]

Wall jumping would also be nice for running in a tunnel/corridor thing, jumping, and kicking off the wall to go to a higher level without slowing down much.

[DimensionWarped]

No. Thats exactly what it shouldn't be used for because it supplants gimmicks that do the same thing.

[tentril]

I don't see any problems with variety. You could easily have both in one game.

[DimensionWarped]

You could, but you don't. It's like saying you can have grinding without abusing it, you could but you don't. Things like this are too pervasive to be integrated into the game without compromising it.

[luksamuk]

So, must the next gen of Sonic have been just like the

?

[Epon]

Why is the info page written by a fucking ra-tard?

[Pheonix Gamma]

Interesting food for thought: Nintendo is scared shitless to release Super Mario 4. New Mario Wii had four players. That'd have been a perfect name for it. But they're afraid of what kinda shit that would put them in.

So, must the next gen of Sonic have been just like the

?

I'd do terrible things for a Sonic game like that.

Sexual things.

[Candescence]

Interesting food for thought: Nintendo is scared shitless to release Super Mario 4. New Mario Wii had four players. That'd have been a perfect name for it. But they're afraid of what kinda shit that would put them in.

Super Mario World WAS Super Mario 4. It was its Japanese subtitle.

[Pheonix Gamma]

Well they won't release a Mario 5, then.

Jerk >:V