"Stealing"

[Rael0505]

Everyone in this community is competing to make the best possible project himself. Personally, while I don't mind borrowing assets from official SEGA art if necessary, I simply can't take graphics someone else has made and put it in my game. It feels like cheating. I feel like I can't show it off and be proud of it and call it my own if it's using art contributed by people outside the developing team. That's why I feel so strongly about this - I have to be able to call it my own if I want to feel like I've accomplished something.

Nieves, I understand that you don't see things that way. You're not striving to compete with us for attention, you just wanna use stuff. I'm talking to DW on AIM and he's telling me that we should have more public resources in our community. We should have more to give, not just keep all of our best work to ourselves. But it sounds like you just want to take, you have nothing to give. It sounds like you just want to combine the best of everyone's games into your own game because you're too lazy to learn to do anything yourself. It's frankly a slap in the face to all of us who put actual effort into what we do. I'm all for releasing work for public, but not before I even design my game or the levels they're intended for. You should at least have the decency to respect people's wishes.

As far as I can tell you're just a mooch who has nothing to offer for us. You want to take everything we have but don't want to give us anything. And I'm inclined to believe you won't have much original content in your game, if anything at all. You want a good game without putting in any of your own work.

Thievery is the biggest offense in this community. If you're saying you're going to stick around only to see what else you can steal from us, you're out. And giving credit is still stealing. You can warn me you're going to break into my house and steal my HD TV without permission, but that doesn't mean it's not stealing.

[Tweaker]

Big props to Brad and Rael for their excellent points so far. I'm glad that some people still have common decency and respect towards people for their efforts. I'd personally disagree with the "we're all competing" point with certain exceptions (when competition is explicitly established, for example), but everything else is pretty spot on. Thanks a ton, guys.

I personally found the little part where Nieves said "if I could make my project better by using your graphics, I would" pretty fucking absurd. And you'd take Hunter's original music too? The fuck is wrong with you? You could almost, almost make a point of the tunes were remixes of existing SEGA properties, but original music? You're fucking bonkers, bro. Remind me to never let you in my room; you'll probably steal all of its contents because you think they'll make your own room look better. Prick.

[Nieves]

lol Rael, ok cool.

Sparks

Not far from what you said. Don't consider the views of others, simply recognise that they don't have to be yours. From there, look after your interests as you wish.

Rawr

By carrying I mean carrying the enforcing. If you make your work available for others to copy, with no mechanisms of controlling that, that is you not carrying your responsibility.

But you are correct, I am wanting you guys to see my point. Because this really is a matter of "different strokes" and I'd like at least some people to recognise that this isn't about anything negative I'm doing, but a different positive that you guys generally don't think of. Just like double parking.

Once a reader can see the real positive of both sides, they will have to admit I have a point and are then free to choose which concept they prefer (it looks like competition is a big factor here). Copying some content is not the only way to go, but it has some good ideals.

Rael

Flip, there's so much I have to do. How could it be a good game otherwise? My attention is on the gameplay though.

BlazeHedgehog

You are entitled to it. But to expect a random to not use your sprites is not realistic or responsible. Remember again, I am just a random and I'm not competing with this community.

hRook

Not will, would if it lifted my game. Same as Eminem. Except Eminem doesn't deliberately make his music freely available.

Rael (again)

No, my argument is that there is more positive than most people here will acknowledge. To recognise it, remove the idea you all have of competition for a start. I guess it's like saying "I made a Beyonce mix but it's not like I'm gonna upstage Beyonce with it."

I refer to Sega/Rihanna/etc not to justify the copying, but to point out that you too adjust your morals for situations as they suit you.

Slingerland

If you don't understand something I say, you can ask for clarification. Your insults don't bother me of course; I referred to your language to highlight your lack of leadership or respect as a mod. Look at your post. Look at everyone else's. Yours has the most hot air because everyone else is careful with flaming and drama while you know you don't have to be. It's not a childish attack on you, it's me saying "Protect this thread, don't run it down yourself." The mod being the one to break a thread is not a good sign.

All you have to do to protect the work of posted content is make a private forum. You're attacking me when I'm just one from the internet and it has happened before you say. No-one needs to agree to anything to read these boards. So why not create a setup where there is an agreement. A private board for previewing stuff. Then you have a rule that can be enforced. Not perfectly, but compared to 100% visible... a lot better.

Again I... Well first I don't know what you're reading but I have commented on your idea of stealing several times already. And once again, morally wrong is your belief. I see that you've given me a time limit here so I am going to put it on you. Do you honestly not understand the idea that others don't follow your right and wrong? That a person has no right thinking others agree with his beliefs? People present their work here with no agreement from the outside viewers. Please comment on some of the things I have written instead of just repeating your view with bigger expressions. Can you understand what I'm saying first, then dismiss it second?

And after all that, you do protect your work. I'm glad you prefer that kind of care.

I had no idea about Hunter's music or how available it is. I don't have it.. I don't have anything. But he already said I could stick it on my iRiver. But really... your reactions. Come on man, cool it and let the chat continue.

To finish the reply to you, I ask again that you try to recognise my side before writing more about your astonishment. You can ask for clarifications, no problems. If you like, this is a chance for "one of them" to be freely discussing this topic on your boards, if they can handle it. If you kill the topic I don't change; the issue doesn't change, but now it can't even be spoken about.

I also remind you of that private forum idea. I guess it has been considered before, so what happened with that? A system that lets people in would give more security and freedom I think.

[Nieves]

Just to say it again. This is your chance to discuss it with someone you can dislike. Banning me will only remove that. It won't protect anything on these boards from anyone on the net.

Rael, if I was just a mooch I must have a pretty rotten idea of what a good game is. You don't need to assume that. Gameplay is my focus, none of which is what we call content. I think a game with great content and just-another-rough-Sonic gameplay and structure is an utter waste of time.

[Rawr]

By carrying I mean carrying the enforcing. If you make your work available for others to copy, with no mechanisms of controlling that, that is you not carrying your responsibility.

Okay. Then nobody should ever put out anything ever again because someone out there will find a way to make whatever it is available to anyone anyhow and its the creators fault for doing so because it was their responsibility, even though they put super mega awesome firewall crack protector DRM 2.0 on it to prevent such a thing.

So guys uhh, lets just never be productive with anything ever again . I'm also going to lock myself in a room that only I can get into with all of my stuff in it so people can't get it, or see me, so they cannot copy me or steal me or any of the stuff I do too. Just gotta get some safety precautions in place here!

[Rael0505]

I don't think I worded that part of my post right, Tweaker. While we may not be in direct competition with each other, we're still competing with our own standards to make something original, a product of our own work. I don't know about you, but I feel like if I were to take someone's graphics without asking I'd be failing at producing something myself, and I'd no longer be able to say I'm proud of my work. The thought frankly horrifies me.

also CrazyMrBrad (4:15:12 AM): I just noticed that nieves rhymes with thieves

rofl i love you brad

edit: Nieves, you can try to defend yourself any way you like, but you still have nothing to offer the community and nothing original to contribute to your own game yourself. You're still taking stuff that wasn't meant for you just because you lack the talent to do so yourself. You say you'll focus on the "gameplay" but I honestly doubt with your attitude that'll be anything worthwhile either.

[Slingerland]

If you don't understand something I say, you can ask for clarification. Your insults don't bother me of course; I referred to your language to highlight your lack of leadership or respect as a mod.

You've given your clarifications and they don't make any sense. It all boils down that you're a talentless hack and that you want to make your weasel methods of game creation look okay to the rest of us.

Also, people who come in here and preach like a pretentious idiot don't deserve my respect. Lack of leadership? Funny joke. I'm having a discussion about something I feel strongly about to someone that obviously came in here to start shit. I'm going to be colorful and pissed off. Deal with it. Can you understand that some people talk like this sometimes blahblahblahpretentiousbullshit?

The thread was broken when the thread was started, kid.

And once again, morally wrong is your belief.

Stealing being morally wrong is many people's belief. Maybe that's why it's illegal?

People who don't think that stealing is wrong are either Aladdin or were raised by some fucking terrible parents.

I also remind you of that private forum idea. I guess it has been considered before, so what happened with that? A system that lets people in would give more security and freedom I think.

This forum doesn't need to be private because it's full of decent, respectful people. We all trust each other here that nobody's going to be a complete chode and steal someone else's hard work. People like you are the reason we'd ever need it, but they get banned (which will be happening when this post goes up).

If we had a private forum for registered members, wouldn't that mean you, a thief and registered member, would have access to it? Oops, your plan failed! You've foiled yourself!

Do you honestly not understand the idea that others don't follow your right and wrong? That a person has no right thinking others agree with his beliefs? People present their work here with no agreement from the outside viewers. Please comment on some of the things I have written instead of just repeating your view with bigger expressions. Can you understand what I'm saying first, then dismiss it second?

Based on what everybody else is replying, they're in agreement with me and not you. Even the one guy who's with you thinks that you suck. Stealing is wrong on any level and this discussion isn't going anywhere. You're wrong and you lose.

I understood you when I dismissed you. I understand that you are a thief and want to make thievery an acceptable act.

I also understand that you're simply trolling now. So, I cordially invite you to suck the tip of my penis. Not the whole thing, just the tip. Get the fuck out of our forum.