flame6753 Posted June 21, 2009 Report Share Posted June 21, 2009 http://www.clickteam.com/francois/GracillisFlash.html http://www.clickteam.com/francois/ZebFlash.html They have available for purchase in their web shop. http://www.clickteam.com/epicenter/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=178830#Post178830 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ila Posted June 21, 2009 Report Share Posted June 21, 2009 So, its basically an enhanched version of the old Vitalize! plugin huh? I think I see this as being a somewhat positive step for smaller projects. Also, this could make SAGE that much more interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flame6753 Posted June 21, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2009 So, its basically an enhanched version of the old Vitalize! plugin huh? I think I see this as being a somewhat positive step for smaller projects.Also, this could make SAGE that much more interesting. I was thinking the same thing. I think clickteam saw that the vitialize plugin was somewhat of a hassle to some users and that flash, being the universal plugin for browsers could expand clickteam games to a bigger audience. I don't know about you, but when I go to certain sites, I usually never install browser plugins from third parties. (I know vitalize is safe, but I bet other people have refrained from installing it for one reason or another). As for sage, maybe game Demo's displayed on booth pages as flash games before actually downloading them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron C-T Posted June 21, 2009 Report Share Posted June 21, 2009 So is it like.. actually going to be part of the system or is it another plugin? And would something designed in a Clickteam product and then exported to Flash work as well as if it had just been done in Flash? I don't really know much about making games in Flash? How's it work, exactly? Edit: Not sure how I missed the link before.. :E This causes me to bring up the question: if I design a game using Clickteam products, do they still "count" towards a portfolio? Of course, if at all possible, I'd much rather learn C++ but even after learning it'd still take an insane amount of time to get something going by myself. And designs are designs.. no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GSF Posted June 21, 2009 Report Share Posted June 21, 2009 Apparently, according to the site, you can "export .swf files", which are compatible just as any other .swf file. Sounds pretty interesting, and as a new Vitalize it looks good, because V! only works well in Windows, while Flash doesn't have that problem, like Flame said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flame6753 Posted June 21, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2009 Yeah, apparently there is going to be an update to MMF and TGF. Then when you save your stand alone application, you will be able to export as *.swf. So it is not another plugin, it is plain flash and Its going to be part of the application. As for it being as good as a flash application, gamewise I thinK click apps are much better in presentation value than flash games. But i mean, don't expect to be creating flash movies and cartoons all of a sudden. The interface is still going to be the same clickteam product you've come to know, but the export format will just be flash. Judging by those demonstrations, I'd say they'll come out fine. Of course, there will always be gltiches and differences between a normal stand alone app and a flash file you save just like with the java. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pheonix Gamma Posted June 21, 2009 Report Share Posted June 21, 2009 I don't really know much about making games in Flash? How's it work, exactly? The project is shown as a timeline, since it's an animation program. But individual graphics can be coded to act differently, and individual frames of animation can be coded too. So you'd program the timeline to loop one frame over and over, and then you put in coding in each individual object to do what you need it to do (read key presses, move, animate, whatever). You also need to program the whole stage if you plan on scrolling, since Flash doesn't have a "camera" like Clickteam's stuff. It's not a hard language to learn (I picked it up faster than C++), but I'd be lying if I said that the platform engine I made for a class was easier to make in MMF than in Flash (I never sat down to learn how arrays worked, so making a large level was complicated). The prospect of making stuff in MMF and exporting it to flash is something I'm totally down with, but now I want full vector support Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron C-T Posted June 21, 2009 Report Share Posted June 21, 2009 Hmm.. I'd imagine it'd be more useful to learn C++ if that's how it works. At least then you can get it onto a device or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realm0D Posted June 21, 2009 Report Share Posted June 21, 2009 Thats fantastic news. Makes it much easier to have flash and think of the new possibiliys. I wonder when MMF3 is comming out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shonumi Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Hmm... This is interesting. Intriguing as well. The game I entered in last year's SAGE (Sonic Advent) was a stand alone .exe that was made straight from Adobe Flash. The coding for a lot of Flash nowadays is mostly done in ActionScript 3.0, but I'm only familiar with 2.0. Regardless, the syntax in both are fairly close, and ActionScript itself is very similar to C++. I stopped using Flash for my game projects because 1) C++ has more to offer language wise 2) I can do more things with C++, it's my so to speak mother language for programming and 3) developing games in C++ doesn't require me to use Adobe's expensive software. Granted, with C++ I have to define all of the graphics options and animations myself, Flash wasn't really any easier with Sonic Advent, having to create the entire engine from basically nothing. I've got tons of code laying around if anyone ever wants to see some examples out of curiosity (Sonic Advent is defunct anyway...) Anyways, being able to export things into a SWF file, I'm guessing, wouldn't entail one to learn Flash entirely, but merely translate the executing code into Flash. This has the advantage of being OS portable in a way by being browser based, even the PSP can play Flash; although some games can get pretty big. Also, SWF files are standalone too, not much messing around with other files or libraries. This sounds like a boon to anyone using MMF or TGF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epon Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 ActionScript is just glorified ECMAScript, just like JScript, JavaScript, etc... so from a PLC point of view, how the fsck is MMF compiling it shit to begin with? Is it interpreted? JIT? Now I'm kinda interested how it was done in the first place, cuz there's no way they're rewriting everything just to have this feature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Yeah, this must be way overhyped. They tried to make a .exe to .swf converter plugin for GM and there were barely any functions that were compatible. I can't see MMF being completely different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowgoten Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Yea i can't see this being nearly as awesome as people are making it out to be... http://www.owensworld.com/flashgames/play-592.htm this game comes to mind, the controls fucking suck and everyone plays exactly the same, now i know that can be changed with a bit of programming, but it seems like flash can be limiting, I'm wondering if the conversion process will only allow a certain amount of events/programming/input. Neat I guess for smaller games like shut em ups and stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ila Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Anyway is the update out yet? When it drops, I'd like someone with legitimate access to it to attempt to compile the basic Sonic Worlds test level with it to see if it works. I'm not going to discount this yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Taxman Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 I'd say they're probably using Flash's Alchemy technology to run MMF inside flash. Alchemy allows C/C++ code to be compiled for the Flash JIT stuff. So instead of saving an exe file, the swf export option would generate a swf with the relevant code for Alchemy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flame6753 Posted June 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 No the update isn't out yet. But I have a legit copy of MMF 2 Standard, and I'll be checking this frequently so you can expect I'll try to export Sonic Worlds as soon as it's available. And actually here's something intesting. On the homepage, it also says "Pricing and release time line has not been announced at this time". So does that mean that we're going to have to pay a seperate fee for a liscence to add this function to the runtime? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ila Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Actually I wouldn't be surprised if there was an added liscensing fee, at least for commercial/for profit releases. But eh, one thing at a time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epon Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 So I reckon it'd just compile the needed libraries somehow inside the SWF or something and then just call it the main MMF EXE? This is fucking stupid if that's all it is. Couldn't you just fandangle that with Adobe Air or Google Gears or Cock Docking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DimensionWarped Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 If you can make MMF code run in Flash, I assume it's only a matter of time before Flash emulators start cropping up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epon Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 Not really, as I'm assuming they're just making Win32 calls to have the OS handle the EXE; there's no "translation" really going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Taxman Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 Not really, as I'm assuming they're just making Win32 calls to have the OS handle the EXE; there's no "translation" really going on. The Flash version of MMF, works on my mac though, so there isn't any Windows stuff going on here. Like I said, Clickteam most likely took the engine code of MMF and used alchemy to create a flash implementation of it. Then, they'd just have a template swf file that they could insert your mmf game data via the new swf export option. http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/alchemy/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flame6753 Posted June 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 That sounds about right. Lol, this might not be out for a while, so lets not jump to conclusions. However, I did notice they removed "zoom in" and "zoom out". I know you're not required to have that option, but before this was ever even announced, I always wondered how that would work in a flash / mmf crossover. But no, this doesn't look like a conversion or emulation at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Techokami Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 It will certainly make my clickteam made applications more available to Mac users if anything. Check out the Java runtime, then. In MMF2 Developer, there's an option to build a Java binary optimized for MacOS... or just a generic Java binary for any OS.I've actually gotten Sonic Worlds to run on the latest released version of the Java runtime, but alphatransparency support is very different (it has to be done from the graphic editor, not the object's properties). Because of this, things relying on transparency being controlled this way won't work (this breaks the title card and messes up shields), as well as any semitransparent ink effects (water appears as a big black square). Oh, and there's no OGG support. WAVs and MIDIs only, really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flame6753 Posted June 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 Yeah, I've had the same problem. The same thing happens when I build standard Java for any OS. I actually also tried to build sonic worlds, and besides the transparency problems, I noticed that the 360 degrees engine fails sometimes. One time he just bypassed all the slope detectors. But, I've got more hopes for this "flash export" than the java. Plus Clickteam did say the java still wasn't in its final stage, maybe they'll include in the next update. They say they're working on R249 right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epon Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 The Flash version of MMF, works on my mac though, so there isn't any Windows stuff going on here. Like I said, Clickteam most likely took the engine code of MMF and used alchemy to create a flash implementation of it. Then, they'd just have a template swf file that they could insert your mmf game data via the new swf export option.http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/alchemy/ Ooo good point. I'm interested in how certain extensions work; namely ones that rely on Windows-specific shit, then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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