How would Sonic work... As an MMO(RPG)?

[Can of Nothing]

This is a little idea I've been toying with - Yeah, I'll admit I'm not the keenest MMORPG player (grinding gets on me a lot - More or less the reason I ditched Pokemon, but not the point) around, but lots of my irl friends all play 'em, - mostly the Korean ones, fittingly enough - and I've actually played a few of them with them.

Well, with that said, let's take a look into what thos MMOs are like and then discuss what should be done to make Sonic into an MMO! (Note: I'm taking the ROG part of the term out specifically because frankly, I don't thnk that aspect of MMOs are compatible with Sonic.)

So there's a lot of games out there, and many with a unique style... What should we get into first? Hmm... Well, let's start with what most (if not all) MMOs worth their salt has: Grinding and Levels.

Levels are a feature in most RPGs - In ERPGs at least, that have a limited amount of gameplay tied to the story with most being unable to revisit after clearing the game, levels are to divide players: if everyone can have different stats against thesame enemy, it's rather like other games, where it's dependent on your playing skill - but there's a catch. It's actually depenent on your playing time.

This is no less true in the MMOs I know - every one of them has a minimalist plot (except MapleStory which is just a massively bloated cliche, and even then it doesn't even matter in-game if you're playing as... Well, almost anything) and a massive world, leaving you to supposedly "Adventure in this Massive world!" - but as a sad single guy driving a sad single c- I mean, tiny nublet that intentionally nerfs much of what you can do, even if you're a veteran player at said game who accidentally forgot his password. This means that if you want to do anything in-game, you'll have to grind for levels or money. (since there is no story, there's no flow into when and what you can do, and no subtle enemy progression leading you further into the levels for taking down bosses) This also means that for the most part, how good you are at in MMOs dependent on how long you've been playing as a single character. It also means that (as long as there's none of that missing attacks completely due to low level stuff) how good you are in an MMO is how low your level is when you have accomplished a task - struggling with a self-given challenge, much like the famous Nuzlocke Challenge.

Now, when you first take a glance at Sonic (especially Unleashed-Colors-Generations-Rush-RushAdventure - pretending Lost World doesn't exist for a sec.) gameplay, you might think "Yeah, but how could this be an MMO?!" - a valid thought. But true to Can of Nothing tradition, we're going for the unconventional: (ironically conventional to Sonic) taking the good features of MMOs and bending them to fit Sonic. This means that my suggestion is a potentially unmarketable disaster with virtually no appeal but is also a large innovation as far as I know.

This is very slightly inspired by a certain Korean MMO called Crazy Arcade BnB: an MMO Bomberman clone. While it's impossible to call the game 'original', it shows that an 'Arcade' style game can work as an MMO - and that people can and will like it. (People may know the series better with KartRider - a Mario Kart ripoff that has a free iPhone app - KartRider Rush - albeit with in-game purchases for most of its content.)

First off, let's decide what we want to keep from MMOs. Here's a list:

Levels: Intergrated into ranks - heavily modified to promote skill over playing time

Character classes: Non-permanent and based off your playing style

Customizable moveset: Intergrated into the Skill Shop - limited amount of moves, as well as limited "points" per se

Customizable character appearance: Taken 100%! This would be a fancharacter creator's dream - and while it wouldn't do anything to help the F Yeah Bad Sonic Fancharacters blog, (or it might?!) it might still attract a handful of thos fancharacters - especially newbie hackers that just hack their fancharacter over Sonic or the ones that are in the fanbase just for the fancharacters.

In-game purchases: A neccesary sin - but absolutely optional. The game will be playable without the custom equipment - just that that jacket would look fantastic on your fancharacter there~

...wait, that's it? Oh well, now let's get crackin'!

Imagine a White Space of sorts: a 2D hub world that leads to the levels that the game has to offer. The first time you play, you're taken to a tutorial level, and as soon as you know how to play.. Another tutorial level?

This is necessary, however, to determine the player's play style: whether they're more akin to Sonic, taking for the fastest path, be there goodies or not, like Knuckles, taking a combat-oriented (yes, it's back, but... Imagine Rayman Origins with SSB-esque combos, will ya) path, taking a bit longer than the other paths for the added price of the points making up for it, or Tails, choosing a heavily platforming-style path, later to get the ability to fly. After this is done, you can choose between the levels - as well as the option to play against someone or just to go on your own. Little to no interaction is done in the levels - the main part of that is taken place in White Space. Levels are gone and replaced with Ranks - your rank on every level combined (Stages that aren't cleared are on Z by default) and placed on an average scale ranging from A to Z. (thus removing S's significance) Based on your rank and playing style, there will be a wide moveset given to you: including the Boost, Drift and Homing Attack for Speed, a hover, double jump and flight for... Well, Flight, and... Uh... A werehog-esque homing attack punch that targets an enemy near you (but not necessarily dragging you towards it) and.. Uh, Knuckles' SA2 moves? - for Power.

That is what I think an MMO in the gameplay style of Sonic could be - a nice progression (albeit 2D) of Modern Sonic's gameplay. I'm sorry if this all doesn't make sense - I typed this on an iPad for about an hour or so. @_@

So... What do you guys think? Is my suggestion okay? Do you have a better idea? Any general comments?

[Nemox]

I've been thinking about this subject alongside my learning of game development, and I think it could be a cool idea if done properly. I think on a different sort of paradigm regarding this, but I hope to provide something interesting at least.

As a reviewer I sometimes watch has approximately said, Sonic is about momentum, platforming, and exploration.

First two first; momentum-based platforming. Sonic, at its core, is character-physics-based sandbox gameplay, in a way. The game is all about making simply controlling the character and using momentum engaging, and levels are a way to focus the player's engagement by providing a goal.

I think this ties in well with exploration. The extrinsic goal is to save the world and such; to engage with this unique world and characters in different ways. To experience different sides of things. A deeper world to experience. The world itself is alien and yet familiar, incorporating abstract and artistic renditions of things we understand from our world. The characters lend themselves to a great deal of exploration as well, with as many options as there are species, colours, fashions, or personalities as there are in the world.

The Sonic world provides many outlets for players to express their creativity if they so choose, like with my original character Blonic.

People don't tend to play games for points these days. Competitive players may do speed runs and such, but ultimately there has to be some sort of higher goal in mind to keep things interesting. I believe that allowing a great degree of freedom, allowing for this creativity in both player characters as other MMOs have, and especially allowing for creativity in gameplay, will create a game that lasts longer than the first few runs of each stage.

Chao Gardens are testament to this. They offer self-expression, a deepening of the world, and an extrinsic goal to enjoy the intrinsically-fun gameplay even more.

Pair this with a robust character creation system, relatively large worlds to explore (with hub worlds that are actually interesting to play around in), and of course all within an amazingly fun gameplay base, and you've got a formula for a potentially fun game.

(Rewrote this a few times, trying to keep my mind focused. Hope that wasn't too abstract.)

[Serephim]

Cant see it working. There is nothing about Sonic the Hedgehog that synergizes with MMO style grinding or progression. Forcing it is too obvious, Sega has done it plenty of times and everyone hated it.

[Nemox]

Cant see it working. There is nothing about Sonic the Hedgehog that synergizes with MMO style grinding or progression. Forcing it is too obvious, Sega has done it plenty of times and everyone hated it.

Not all MMOs are themepark MMORPGs. Warframe is a lobby-based shoot'em-up, and Kart Rider is a lobby-based racer, for example.

The reason MMOs exist is for the social aspect. Doing video game things you love to do with friends! Like playing as Tails! This is a pretty cool thing, eh?

There can also be a form of progression like any other game has; Sonic Generation has those upgrades at the Chao shop, SA1&2 have Chao Gardens, Shadow has various weapons, and many games have an unlockable super form.

An MMO with custom player characters also allows a unique form of progression as well; character aesthetics. Grinding rings is something that could be done, and it would facilitate deeper exploration of the world. It could also give players new reasons to platform their way to places they'd never reached before.

Just takes some out-of-the-box thinking. Given, perhaps an MMO -maaay- not be the optimal way to go, but I could definitely see it being a large online multiplayer game. Something like you'd see Minecraft or FPS players play.

[TheJeli]

Wouldn't it be coll just to run around levels with 10 of your friends. Wouldn't make a good MMO, but it would be cool to have race 12 people in Green Hill Act 2 from Generations.

[Serephim]

Not all MMOs are themepark MMORPGs. Warframe is a lobby-based shoot'em-up, and Kart Rider is a lobby-based racer, for example.

The reason MMOs exist is for the social aspect. Doing video game things you love to do with friends! Like playing as Tails! This is a pretty cool thing, eh?

There can also be a form of progression like any other game has; Sonic Generation has those upgrades at the Chao shop, SA1&2 have Chao Gardens, Shadow has various weapons, and many games have an unlockable super form.

An MMO with custom player characters also allows a unique form of progression as well; character aesthetics. Grinding rings is something that could be done, and it would facilitate deeper exploration of the world. It could also give players new reasons to platform their way to places they'd never reached before.

A Sonic "MMO" would probably best function like Mario Kart or Gran Turismo. A series of maps and contests, with progression determined by ranks and leaderboards. The entire game would have to be skill-central, and the levels would have to reflect this. I think a mixture of SA2's trick-based levels and Unleashed's endgame focus on speed management and handling would be the best mix for this. A-ranking in SA2 generally forced you to make use of stage elements while keeping a steady pace. Unleashed/Gen has no real ranking system, but generally the replay value exists in finding ways to maintain momentum without murdering yourself.

Characters would probably be grouped into class, with RPG parameters that give slight boosts. But being a skill-based game, you would do as little as you can to drift players away from a fair, standardized ground. So ultimately any RPG-style parameters would need to be very easily maxed within a trivial amount of playtime. Instead of Stage A ----> Stage B progression, it'd probably be more like Rank F --> Rank S class maps, that simply get harder and harder to complete in a timely manner without making good use of player physics or knowing the stage well.

This is about the only way i can see a Sonic MMO working. If you try to slant the game towards a more social, cooperative, grind-based Platformer-RPG then you'd end up with one huge shitty mess of an annoying game, because you would have to change way too much about the existing formula to accommodate grinding, earning skills, buying customization, ect ect.

[Jassbec]

I imagine a Sonic "MMO" being a "Metroidvania" kind of game, the only thing similar to what I imagine is Sonic Chrono Adventure or Sonic BTS Aftermath if they were multiplayer, I don't know why, but playing a classic Sonic styled Metroidvania game with your friends would be a very cool thing to be honest.

That way you can implement RPG elements without stopping being a Sonic game. But that's just me.

[TailsSena]

When I try to think of multiplayer Sonic game, the only thing that comes to mind is Sonic Shuffle. I'm not sure if that's a good thing.

[Nemox]

When I try to think of multiplayer Sonic game, the only thing that comes to mind is Sonic Shuffle. I'm not sure if that's a good thing.

Sonic 06's was practically a redeeming quality.

[InfinityAlex]

I'm thinking something more along the lines of a racing/beat 'em up PvP with 100% character customization. Players fight each other while constantly moving, with a combo system similar to Street Fighter or Smash Bros. Melee, allowing for fast-paced combat, almost like most Sonic fight animations. Maybe I'm just into Mario & Luigi: Dream Team Bros. too much...

[luksamuk]

I didn't really read anything on this topic, but I'd like to share something with you guys.

 

One of these days, a friend that lives with me just woke up and said "I had this weird dream in which I was playing a Sonic MMO".

 

He described that the mechanics were rather simple. It was a 3D game, and there wasn't anything you wouldn't find in Sonic Adventure on the moves: Homing Attack, jumping, running around.

But he said the big catch were how the enemies were interesting, complex, and beating them depended on attacking on the right spot at the right time.

He also said that he believed another players could come and help you beat that enemy, but he was unsure how (it was a dream, after all) and the playable characters he saw were Sonic, Tails, Knuckles and maybe Shadow.

 

When I asked him about the possibilities of other characters like Amy, Blaze, Chaotix or whatever, he stated that, in his opinion, it'd be much more interesting if it stick to the original trio (haha, this kinda beats the MMO thing, unless you could have multiple instances of the same character). That's some valuable info, since he's not a Sonic fan -- in fact, the last Sonic game he played was Sonic 1 about six years ago.

 

I know this might be a little too subjective, but maybe I could inspire someone here. He plays League of Legends, Final Fantasy and Monster Hunter quite a lot, apart from others, and since I'm not much of an RPG or MMOs in general player, he's the biggest example I get when I think of these genres (or whatever it is).

 

PS. Sorry for the vague explanation again. After all, it's a dream retold by other person lol. I'll see if I can grab some more info from my friend.

Edited December 15, 2013 by luksamuk

[ChaosLord]

Never seen this topic before but now someone has brought it up...:

 

Huge persistent world containing all the famous zones seamlessly linked together, WoW style. SA2/Generations physics. No turn-based MMORPG elements. Actual attacks like in the games.

 

Dungeon/Quest equivalents being race tracks and/or "Action stages" where you team up with others to take on more open levels. They're found dotted around the Zones. Zones are regions which contain stages themed on that Zone and contain players of Level X to Y. The levels don't require multiple people due to the enemy strength (but there are a lot of enemies) but they're needed because you need teamwork to overcome various obstacles, e.g. a strength character like Knuckles would be used to break obstacles or something, for the team. Some things would require tag team moves, e.g. speed characters combining with power characters to... bulldoze something, I dunno, I haven't thought out the details.

 

You would level up by defeating enemies, collecting rings, doing Action stages and PvP events. Leveling would enable you to purchase items such as those in the Adventure games (bounce bracelet or whatever), as well as vanity items (some are earned by defeating certain stages or bosses). Rings would be currency, earned by collecting in stages and completing Action stages. Have a feeling you could worm the Chaos Emeralds in there somewhere. Unsure if it should be a story thing or a character specific thing (maybe the overall story is that the emeralds have been shattered and you can collect shards and if you have enough shards of each emerald you can use them to go super? That way everyone could have their own emerald...)

 

PvP would consist of multiple game modes such as races, 1-on-1 fights, and maybe some team games like Capture the Flag scenarios (imagine chasing people down in that...).

 

There would be various classes, similar to Heroes but more expansive, such as Magic/Psychic characters like Blaze and Silver, Thief-style roles such as Fang, and Tech roles such as Eggman and Tails.

 

Certain zones would be sectioned off in difficulty based on what gear you have. Unsure how bosses would work. I see them scaling in strength based on the levels of the party attacking. It'd work like a normal boss battle in Sonic but with a proper numeric health bar instead of a certain number of hits. His strength, defense, health etc would be determined by aspects of the party.

 

POSSIBLY end each zone with some huge boss that requires you to be of a certain level to face (might be too restricting). Another uncertainty: enemies have health bars too and their own stats so you need higher levels and/or gear to face them but... they might be a bit weird seeing 10 Sonic clones homing attacking some Motobug over and over. Might stick with the gear required to pass certain obstacles element. E.g. to get to the next Zone, you have to have purchased the Light Dash shoes or something which are a lvl 10 item so you need to be lvl 10 to access the next zone (stops people just running to the last zone).

 

Character creation would consist of picking a species and a class (possibly picking an allegiance too... Like the Light/Dark side stories of Adventure 2. Could make for some interesting clan wars).

 

And yeah, clans just for fun.

 

There's  social hubs between/in zones such as Station Square or whatever, which contain shops, training stages, socialising areas, dueling areas, maybe even housing, and so on.

 

Only problems I see are:

1. Team balancing. 2 Power characters where one is a seasoned player and one is new makes the new one seem redundant. Either levels have to be specifically designed to take advantage of all players OR there needs to be a balancing thing before hand (unless you've chosen to play with friends then it's whatever layout you want, as long as your team has 1 of each class and if it doesn't, it finds some random people who are just looking for any team, to join).

 

2. Solo instances would be lacking. There'd be some 1-player levels specific to each class but... I don't really see the point of getting a Sonic MMO in the way I describe and then playing a bunch of 1-player levels anyway.

 

So yeah, I think the idea is feasible (prolly full of flaws, I thought it up as I was typing, damn it). Dunno whether it'd take off. Most established franchise MMO attempts tend to either fail or just... become unheard of.

 

I'd play my version though. Brb finding C++ networking libraries.